Infinite Loops

Spencer Greenberg, mathematician, founder of Clearer Thinking, and co-author of The 12 Levers, joins Jim O'Shaughnessy on Infinite Loops to talk about which self-help techniques hold up to evidence, why memory works like autocomplete, how exposure therapy cured his lifelong social anxiety, why the law of attraction can backfire, how to design hiring interviews that predict performance, and what his team found replicating new studies from top psychology journals.
Show Notes
Spencer Greenberg & Jim O'Shaughnessy
Spencer Greenberg: Mathematician and entrepreneur, founder of ClearerThinking.org and Spark Wave, and host of the Clearer Thinking podcast. Clearer Thinking

The 12 Levers: Spencer and Jeremy Stevenson's evidence-based toolkit for improving your life. The 12 Levers

Clearer Thinking podcast: Spencer's interview show, where Jim has been a guest. Listen

Transparent Replications: Spencer's project that randomly picks and re-runs new studies from top psychology journals. Transparent Replications

Importance hacking: Spencer's essay on the problem his replications uncovered. Read the essay

Jim O'Shaughnessy: Host of Infinite Loops, founder and CEO of O'Shaughnessy Ventures, and author of the New York Times bestseller What Works on Wall Street. Follow Jim on X

Full transcripts: Transcripts and highlights from every Infinite Loops conversation. OSV newsletter

Books & Ideas Mentioned
Reality tunnels: Robert Anton Wilson's idea that everyone perceives a different version of reality. Reality tunnel

The Challenger memory study: Research showing how far people's memories of a major event drift over time. Flashbulb memory

Spaced repetition: Spencer's recommended method for remembering what matters. Spaced repetition

My Dinner with Andre: The film that shaped how Jim designed Infinite Loops. My Dinner with Andre

Behavioral activation: The evidence-based depression technique Spencer describes. Behavioral activation

Daniel Kahneman: Whose work for the Israeli military showed which interview methods actually predict performance. Daniel Kahneman

Pre-mortem: The technique of imagining a plan has failed and working out why. Pre-mortem

Replication crisis: The finding that many published psychology results don't hold up when re-run. Replication crisis

John Sarno: The NYU physician whose work on the mind's role in chronic pain Jim credits with curing his frozen neck. John E. Sarno

Molecules of Emotion by Candace Pert: Jim's reference on how emotions show up physically in the body. Candace Pert

Mirror box therapy: The phantom limb treatment Spencer uses to show the brain can reinterpret a pain signal. Mirror box

Pre-order No One's Coming to Save You today: https://infinitebooks.com/products/no-ones-coming-to-save-you
David Rhoiney was five when his father walked out, forcing David to become the "man of the house."
Compton, Oakland, Long Beach: no matter where they turned, fear and hunger waited. Long nights in the homeless shelter. Drive-by shootings. Strangers in overalls dragging his mother away. As his world collapsed, David lost hope. No one was coming to save him.
But he could save himself.
When basketball threw him a lifeline, David grabbed it. So began an unlikely journey, one that carried him from living in a Volkswagen Jetta onto the courts of Division I, through the halls of the Naval Academy, into the corridors of national intelligence, and under the watchtowers of Guantánamo Bay. At last, scalpel in hand, David reached the operating room, where he could become the man his family needed.
Ed William, a former lawyer, spent several days interviewing David and spoke to dozens of people from his life. The result is Ed's first book, No One's Coming to Save You: The Escape of David Rhoiney, out from Infinite Books on 8 December and now available for pre-order: https://infinitebooks.com/products/no-ones-coming-to-save-you
"A powerful and deeply moving account of a boy forced to grow up too soon and the man he fought to become."
—Rob Henderson, bestselling author of Troubled
Ed joins Jim to discuss:
The time David was forced to fight a schoolyard bully in front of his family.

David's unusual experience of the Rodney King riots.

The note David wrote to God every night.

The English teacher who changed David's life in one hour. 

The prep school coach who cancelled David's credit cards. 

How a five-foot-three kid ended up playing Division I basketball. 

David as a role model for young men.

The guilt underpinning David's success.  

The single word that describes David. 

Why Ed's interview plan fell apart in the first 5 minutes. 

Why Ed was inspired by Into the Wild and Raiders of the Lost Ark.

How Ed captured David's voice.

Much more!




Show Notes
Ed William & Jim O'Shaughnessy
Ed William: Writer, editor, former lawyer and author of No One's Coming to Save You. Read Rough Cuts

The book: No One's Coming to Save You: The Escape of David Rhoiney, out December 8, 2026. Pre-order

Infinite Books: The publishing imprint behind the book. Infinite Books

Jim O'Shaughnessy: Host of Infinite Loops, founder and CEO of O'Shaughnessy Ventures, and author of the New York Times bestseller What Works on Wall Street. Follow Jim on X

Full transcripts: Transcripts and highlights from every Infinite Loops conversation. OSV newsletter

Books, Films & Ideas Mentioned
Into the Wild: The film Ed compares to the Houston chapter, where David almost stops to rest. Into the Wild

Raiders of the Lost Ark: Spielberg's "no boring bits" approach that set the book's pace. Raiders of the Lost Ark

Mad Max: Fury Road: Ed's model for a story that never stops moving. Mad Max: Fury Road

The Pursuit of Happyness and Good Will Hunting: The stories Ed sees as the book's closest film parallels. The Pursuit of Happyness / Good Will Hunting

What Works on Wall Street: Jim's book, which David challenged him on in their first conversations. What Works on Wall Street

Behaviorism: The mid-century "give me a baby and I'll make it anything" school Jim cites in the nature-versus-nurture debate. Behaviorism

Emma Camp, senior newsletter editor at The Wall Street Journal's Free Expression, joins Jim O'Shaughnessy on Infinite Loops to talk about why Gen Z is dating less and spending more time alone, how therapy culture and helicopter parenting can turn growing pains into permanent labels, why the fix for the housing shortage is more housing, and why she invites everyone she's met to every party. She also previews her forthcoming essay collection on Gen Z and risk aversion.
Show Notes
Emma Camp & Jim O'Shaughnessy
Emma Camp: Senior newsletter editor at Free Expression, The Wall Street Journal's opinion newsletter, and former Reason magazine editor. Read Free Expression

Emma's breakout essay: Her reflection on the 2022 New York Times op-ed that started her career. After My Big Break

Jim O'Shaughnessy: Host of Infinite Loops, founder and CEO of O'Shaughnessy Ventures, and author of the New York Times bestseller What Works on Wall Street. Follow Jim on X

Full transcripts: Transcripts and highlights from every Infinite Loops conversation. OSV newsletter

Books & Ideas Mentioned
The Grim Old Days by Chelsea Follett: Emma's reference for how hard life was for the average person before modern markets. Chelsea Follett

The Genius of the Beast by Howard Bloom: Jim's reference for what capitalism achieved that earlier systems couldn't. The Genius of the Beast

Jefferson Literary and Debating Society: The University of Virginia society where Emma threw a party every Friday. Jefferson Society

Partiful: The app Emma uses to invite everyone to every party. Partiful

Sally Rooney: The novelist Emma writes about in her essays on modern relationships. Sally Rooney

Attachment theory: Emma's frame for why a secure marriage lets her take more social risks. Attachment theory

NAR 2025 Profile of Home Buyers and Sellers: The data on first-time buyers reaching a record median age of 40. Coverage

Julie Fredrickson, Managing Partner of Chaotic Capital, rejoins Jim O'Shaughnessy on Infinite Loops to talk about Montana's Right to Compute Act, why verified human data may become one of the most valuable assets online, what nuclear power and the encryption wars teach about regulating AI, why chatbots keep recommending the same sunscreen, and what 2,089 days of daily public writing taught her about being wrong. It is her second Infinite Loops conversation, three years after Episode 181.
Show Notes
Julie Fredrickson & Jim O'Shaughnessy
Julie Fredrickson: Managing Partner of Chaotic Capital, an early-stage venture fund, and a former founder in e-commerce and beauty. Chaotic Capital

Julie on X: Julie's preferred way to be reached. Follow Julie on X

Julie's daily writing: More than 2,000 consecutive days of public writing, started January 1, 2021. Read Julie's blog

Jim O'Shaughnessy: Host of Infinite Loops, founder and CEO of O'Shaughnessy Ventures, and author of the New York Times bestseller What Works on Wall Street. Follow Jim on X

Full transcripts: Transcripts and highlights from every Infinite Loops conversation. OSV newsletter

Julie's Work & Projects
Montana's Right to Compute Act: The first state law protecting people's right to own and use computers and AI tools, which Julie advocated for. Read the Right to Compute Act

Valar Atomics: The small modular reactor company founded by Isaiah Taylor, where Julie invested. Valar Atomics

Julie's first Infinite Loops episode: Episode 181, "Circumstances change. Humanity doesn't. Plan accordingly." Watch Episode 181

Books & Ideas Mentioned
The Beginning of Infinity by David Deutsch: Jim's reference for why no one in 1900 could have predicted the internet. The Beginning of Infinity

Carlota Perez: The economist whose work on technology booms and build-outs shapes Julie's view that AI is still in its invention phase. Carlota Perez

Rainbows End by Vernor Vinge: The novel Julie cites for a future where people earn a living doing small tasks only humans can do. Rainbows End

Snow Crash by Neal Stephenson: Julie's reference for how ideas spread like a virus through programmers. Snow Crash

Fall; or, Dodge in Hell by Neal Stephenson: The novel Julie describes, in which Americans mourn victims of a nuclear attack that never happened. Fall; or, Dodge in Hell

The WEIRDest People in the World by Joseph Henrich: Jim's reference on how long cultures take to adapt to new technology. The WEIRDest People in the World

Nineteen Eighty-Four by George Orwell: Jim's starting point for cognitive security and invented history. Nineteen Eighty-Four

From Googlebot to GPTBot: Cloudflare's report on the rise in AI crawler traffic that Julie cites. Cloudflare report

The Vesuvius Challenge: The project reading the Herculaneum scrolls, subject of a documentary from Infinite Films. Vesuvius Challenge

Agrippa's trilemma: Jim's reference for why chasing a claim to its source often ends in sand. Agrippa's trilemma

Derek Sivers, author, entrepreneur, TED speaker, and founder of CD Baby, joins Jim O'Shaughnessy on Infinite Loops to talk about parenting a teenager who is ready to leave home, why he moves countries on purpose and plans to live in Bangalore and Shanghai next, the certainty slider, and how AI can make you less dependent on big tech, not more. It is his first podcast after more than a year of saying no to every request.
Show Notes
Derek Sivers & Jim O'Shaughnessy
Derek Sivers: Author, entrepreneur, and TED speaker, and founder of CD Baby, once the largest seller of independent music online. Derek's website

Derek on X: Where Derek shares his writing. Follow Derek on X

Derek's TED talks: Including "How to Start a Movement," his most popular talk. Watch Derek's talks

Jim O'Shaughnessy: Host of Infinite Loops, founder and CEO of O'Shaughnessy Ventures, and author of the New York Times bestseller What Works on Wall Street. Follow Jim on X

Full transcripts: Transcripts and highlights from every Infinite Loops conversation. OSV newsletter

Derek's Books & Projects
Useful Not True: Derek's book on skepticism and choosing beliefs because they are useful, not because they are true. Useful Not True

How to Live: 27 conflicting answers on how to live, which Derek calls his masterpiece. How to Live

Hell Yeah or No: Simple mental models for deciding what's worth doing. Hell Yeah or No

Anything You Want: Derek's bestselling book of 40 lessons from starting, building, and selling CD Baby. Anything You Want

Tech Independence: Step-by-step instructions and a setup script for running your own server and email instead of depending on big tech. Tech Independence

Books & Ideas Mentioned
Personal Development for Smart People by Steve Pavlina: The book whose idea about seeking surprise sent Derek around the world. Derek's notes

China's World View by David Daokui Li: Derek's pick for understanding the Chinese government's point of view. Derek's notes

Maverick by Ricardo Semler: The book behind Derek's short-lived profit-sharing plan at CD Baby. Maverick

Why Greatness Cannot Be Planned by Kenneth O. Stanley and Joel Lehman: Jim's reference on why new vantage points change where you want to go. Why Greatness Cannot Be Planned

The Beginning of Infinity by David Deutsch: The book Jim calls a definitive look at how he sees the world. The Beginning of Infinity

Nothing & Everything by Val N. Tine: The book on nihilism Derek recommends, with his advice to read only the first half. Derek's notes